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What is explanation for the following relationships between jiva and bramhan and which is most appropriate.

marked as duplicate by Keshav Srinivasan Jun 3 '16 at 16:41

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Here your All Doubts will Clear of Visisthadvaita Philosophy.Here also clear the Philosophy of Advaita and Dvaita as well as Abhed,Bhed Sruti (Advaita & Dvaita) and also demonstrate Gatak sruti

Here we will understand this Philosophy from the Basic, I will try my best to demonstrate this Philosophy through the Sruti , Bhagvad-Gita and Ramanuja-Philosophy so, we can eailsy understand the main concept of Visisthadavita Philosophy and also the relation between Brahman & Jiva

Understand words in my answer:

Jad=unconcsious=Dead-elements(Nature/Earth)

Chetan=Concsious=Living-elements (Human-beings,gods,antigods,animals etc)

Maya=Illusion

Visesan(विशेषण)= Adjactive, Visesya(विशेष्य)= Substantive , Visistha (विशिष्ट)= Individual

First Let's see what Gatak sruti says:

Gatak Sruti:

visisthacye visisthacye visistha visithayodaitam visisthadiatam | sukhsma jadchetan visistha sthulam chidchidrisithayordriatam bhedithertha: ||

Without Adjactive (विशेषण) there is no meaning of Substantive (विशेष्य). in-other word who is free from Adjactive (विशेषण) is called Individual (विशिष्ट).Lord Vishnu is Individual (विशिष्ट) who is different from jad(unconscious) and Chetan (conscious),even-though they are not different from Lord Vishnu is called Visisthaadivate.

Like we can not sperate the Virtue (गुण) from Virtuness (गुणी), same way Adjactive( Jad(Nature), Chetan(Living-Beings)) can't be sperated from the Visistha (Individual) (Lord Vishnu).

Like body and soul both are different from each other but we can't sperated both thing from each-other. same way jad-chetan and Supreme Lord Vishnu are different yet we can't sperated jad-chetan (Nature & Living-beings) and Lord vishnu(Super-soul) from each-other.

Jad and Chetan (Nature and Living beings) are body of the Lord Vishnu (Supreme Lord), and in this way very beautifully include the both **bhed Shruti (Dvaita) and abhed Shruti (Advaita).

Like Living-beings(Souls) do all the work through his body same-way, Lord Vishnu does his every work through jad and Chetan (Living-entities , nature).

This Example will clear your doubt

For Example

Randomly we call the person whose name is Gopal,so he will turn around and will stare us, because we call him with his name.But we know body is jad (deadly thing, unconscious), If there is no soul(Consciousness) in the body then we will called that "Dead Body" rather than Gopal,Why? because there is no Soul in that body.So,that's mean Gopal is title (Degree) for that particular soul. then why that particualr body turn around and stare us when we called to Gopal??!!.So, that's mean there is no different between gopal and his body,but difference is there we know (Because Gopal is only title/degree for that specific body, If the body is no more then there is no meaning of Gopal).

Same-way Lord and living-beings,nature(jad&chetan) are different ( Davita Philosophy) but they are connected as "body to soul" relation to the supreme lord. so that's why both are same (Advaita Philosophy). ( Here Soul is Lord Vishnu and body is living-beings & nature)

Here body (Jad/Chetan Both(nature/all living beings):

Body: Human-beings, animals , demigods, antigods,gods, nature, all univers etc etc

Soul: Lord Vishnu

More simple example we can take, Mango and it's taste , we know that mango and it's taste both are different (Dviata philosophy) from each other,In other hand,they both are same(Adviata Philosophy)we can't separate both of them (mango & it's taste) from each other.

Hence the solution given by the Visisthadviata Philosophy through the Gatak-Sruti

If you want to read more Details then you can read Sri-ramanujacharaya "Vedarth Sangraha"

Here another sloka from Gatak Sruti:

yamatama Na Ved yesaya Atama Sariram | Yum Pruthvi na ved yesaya Pruthvi Sariram ||

Living-Beings are body of Lord, Living beings don't know this thing, Nature (Earth) is the body of Lord, even nature doesn't know this thing. Living-Beings and Maya(Nature) is the body of Lord and the Lord Vishnu is the seated as soul in that body (living-beings & nature).

In Sri-Valmiki Ramayan This Sloka indicates:

Jagat sarvah sariram tey saitharya tey Vasudhatalam.....

meaning : This all Univers is body of yours (Lord Vishnu), and the all things in nature is depended on you(Lord Vishnu).

In Vishnu Puran this sloka indicates:

Sarvah vai harestanu...|

meaning: All the elements(Living-Beings, Nature) are body of Lord Shri Hari.

Let's we understand from the Bhagvad-Gita (Chapter 9 sloka 4,5,6,8,9,10) which encouraged the Philosophy of Visisthadvaita

mayā tatam idaṃ sarvaṃ jagad avyakta mūrtinā | mat-sthāni sarva bhūtāni na cāhaṃ teṣv-avasthitaḥ || 4 ||

This entire universe is pervaded by Me, in an unmanifest form. All beings abide in Me, but I do not abide in them.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

This entire universe — composed of both sentient and insentient beings, is pervaded by Me — the inner controller whose essential nature is unmanifest. The meaning is that all this universe is pervaded by Krishna the Principal (śeṣi) so that He may sustain and manage it. This [doctrine of] universal pervasion by an inner controller, who is invisible to all beings, is taught in the Antaryāmi- Brāhmaṇa. So also Krishna’s primacy over everything is taught.

na ca mat-sthāni bhūtāni paśya me yogam aiśvaram | bhūta-bhṛnna ca bhūtastho mamātmā bhūta-bhāvanaḥ || 5 ||

And yet beings do not abide in Me. Behold My divine Yoga, I am the upholder of all beings and yet I am not in them. My will alone causes their existence.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

“I am not in them” means — “I do not depend on them for My existence. I do not need any help from them to exist. And yet beings do not abide in Me, as I do not support them as a jug or any other kind of vessel supports the water contained in it. How then are they contained? By My will. Behold My divine Yogic Power, namely, My wonderful Divine qualities, unique to Me alone and having no comparison elsewhere. What are these qualities? I am the sustainer of all beings and yet I am not in them — My will alone keeps them in existence.” The gist is that Krishna is the supporter of all beings, and yet He derives no personal assistance whatever from them. His will alone projects, sustains and controls all beings. Sri Krishna gives an illustration to show how all beings depend on His will for their existence and activity;

yathākāśa-sthito nityaṃ vāyuḥ sarvatrago mahān | tathā sarvāṇi bhūtāni mat-sthānīty-upadhāraya || 6 ||

As the mighty wind moving everywhere, ever remains in space, even so, know that all beings abide in Me.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

The mighty wind exists and moves everywhere in space without any perceivable support. So it has to be admitted that the powerful air-current is dependent on Me for its existence and is being upheld by Me alone. Even so, know that all entities abide in Me, who am invisible to them, and that they are upheld by Me alone. The Vedic sages declare thus: — The origin of clouds, the waters of the ocean remaining within bounds, the phases of the moon, the strong movements of the gale, the flash of lightning and the movements of the sun—all these are marvellous manifestations of the power of Vishnu. (?) The meaning is that they are all the marvellous miracles which are unique to Vishnu. The Vedas and other texts also declare likewise: ‘Verily O Gargi, at the command of that imperishable One, the sun and the moon stand apart’ (Br. Up., 3.8.9,) ‘Through the fear of Him the wind blows, through the fear of Him the sun rises, through the fear of Him Agni and Indra perform their duties’ (Tai. Up., 2.8.1). It has been declared that the existence and activity of all beings originate by the will of the Supreme Being, who is totally independent.

Now Sri Krishna declares that the origin and dissolution of all entities also are accomplished by His will only:—

sarva bhūtāni kaunteya prakṛtiṃ yānti māmikām | kalpa-kṣaye punas-tāni kalpādau visṛjāmy-aham || 7 ||

All beings, O Arjuna, are assimilated into My Nature (Prakrti) at the end of a cycle of time (kalpa). Again I send them forth at the beginning of a new cycle.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

All the mobile and immobile entities enter into Krishna’s Being (Prakrti) at the end of a cycle, of Brahma’s life. This Prakrti (Nature), constituting the Divine Being, is described by the term Tamas, as it cannot be differentiated into name and form. Manu also concurs: ‘This universe became Tamas.... by an act of [divine] will. He produced it out of His body’ (Manu, 1.5.8). The Vedas also declare this: — ‘He whose physical nature is Unmanifest’ (Sub. Up., 7); ‘The Unmanifest (avyakta) merges into the Imperishable (akṣara), the akṣara into (Darkness) Tamas’ (Ibid., 2); and also — ‘There was Darkness (Tamas); consciousness was in the beginning concealed by Darkness (Tamas)’ (Tai. Br. ii:8-9)

prakṛtiṃ svām-avaṣṭabhya visṛjāmi punaḥ punaḥ | bhūta-grāmam imaṃ kṛtsnam avaśaṃ prakṛter-vaśāt || 8 ||

Animating my own Nature [Prakrti], I send forth again and again all this multitude of beings, helpless under the sway of Prakrti.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

“I develop it eightfold and send forth this fourfold aggregate of beings; gods, animals, humans and inanimate things, time after time. All these entities are helpless, being under the sway of Prakrti comprising the three Gunas which cause delusion.”If this is so, it may be argued that the inequalities of creation are due to the Lord being cruel or partial etc."

To this, the Lord answers: —

na ca māṃ tāni karmāṇi nibadhnanti dhanañjaya | udāsīnavad-āsīnam asaktaṃ teṣu karmasu || 9 ||

But these actions do not bind Me, O Dhanañjaya, for I remain detached from them, remaining like one indifferent.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

“But results like the inequality of creation do not bind Me. I cannot be accused of such negative qualities as cruelty, partiality etc, because the differences of conditions like being born as a god, human being, animal or vegetable are all caused by the previous actions (Karmas) of individual Jīvas themselves. I am unaffected by these inequalities.” Accordingly, the author of the Vedanta-sutras says: — ‘There is no partiality or lack of compassion in Him, because creation is dependent on Karma, for so Scripture declares’ (Br. Sutra., 2.1.34), and ‘If it be said that there can be no Karma on account of non-distinction [between Jīvas and Brahman prior to creation], it is replied that this is incorrect, because both the Jīvas and Karma are beginningless....’ (Ibid. 2.1.35).

mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sacarācaram | hetunānena kaunteya jagad viparivartate || 10 ||

Under My supervision, Prakrti produces all beings that move and move not. Indeed, because of this, O Kaunteya, does the world revolve.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

Behold in this wonderful phenomena the cosmic dominion inherent in Krishna, and personal characteristics such as sovereignty, true resolve and being free from cruelty and similar defects! So declare the Vedas:— ‘The possessor of Maya [the Lord] projects this universe out of this [Prakrti in its subtle state]. Another [the individual Self] is confined by Maya in the world. One should know the Maya to be the Prakrti. And the possessor of Maya to be the Mighty Lord’ (Sve. Up., 4;9-10)

Another Sloka of Bhagvad-Gita ( Chapter 7 Sloka 7,12) which encouraged the Philosophy of Visisthadvaita

mattaḥ parataraṃ nānyat kiñcid-asti dhanañjayaḥ | mayi sarvam idaṃ protaṃ sūtre maṇi-gaṇā iva || 7 ||

There is nothing whatsoever higher than Me, O Arjuna. All this is strung on Me, as clusters of gems on a thread.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

“I am absolutely superior to all things in two ways: (1) I am the cause of both the Natures (Prakṛtis) and I am also their Proprietor (śeṣin). The Jīvas exercise control over their bodies as they are the inner proprietors (śeṣin) and I am the Proprietor of all Jīvas. (2) I am also the Supreme Being because I possess knowledge, untiring strength, sovereignty, immutability, creative power and splendour in an infinite degree. The totality of all the sentient and insentient beings, whether in their [unmanifest] causal state or in their [manifest] state of effect, is strung on Me, who abide as their Self, as a cluster of gems on a thread — in other words they have their rest and support in Me.” And it is established that the entire Universe [of sentient and insentient entities] and Brahman (the Supreme Being) exist in the [symbiotic] relationship of body and spirit as declared by the Antaryami-Brahmana and other texts: — ‘He whose body is the earth’ (Br. Up., 3.7-3), ‘He whose body is the Self’ (Br. U. Madh., 3.7.22), ‘He is the Over-Self of all beings, immaculate, He is the Lord in the supreme heaven, He is the one Nārāyaṇa’ (Sub.Up., 7). Everything constitutes the “corporeality” and is an “expression” of the Supreme Being who is their Over-Self, thus the Supreme Being alone exists, and all [existing] things are only His modes [of expression]. Therefore all terms used in common parlance for different things denote Him only.

ye caiva sāttvikā bhāvā rājasāstāmasāśca ye | matta eveti tān-viddhi na tvahaṃ teṣu te mayi || 12 ||

Know that all those states of Sattva, Rajas and Tamas have their origin in Me alone. But I am not in them; they are in Me.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

This Three modes of Illusion (Triguni Maya) is depended on Lord Vishnu, Lord Vishnu is not Depended on this Maya, Lord is not Indulge in this Samsara (Mortal World). like same-way soul is not indulge in body.

The one of the Best Sloka of Bhagvad Gita (Chapter 10 Sloka 41) which is summary of Visisthadvaita Philosophy

yad yad vibhūtimat sattvaṃ śrīmad ūrjitam eva ca | tat tad evāvagaccha tvaṃ mama tejo’ṃśa saṃbhavam || 41 ||

Know for certain that whatever has sovereignty, splendour and brilliance is produced by a mere fraction of My potency.

Ramanuja-Philosophy:

Every Living and Non-Living elements is the body of the Lord and Lord is the Soul of that body, and this the Summary of Sri Visithadviata Philosophy.

Hence, We can say that we got the overall conclusion and Summary of the Ses-Seshi Relation, Soul-Body Relation, Master-Servant Relation, Ulitimate Form of Lord, Bhed and Abhed Sruthi As it is , from the Sri Visisthadviata Philosophy,

Sri-Ramanuja put very great effort to clear the all doubts and easily can reach to the supreme lord. You can also refer Sri-Bhasya, Visithadviata Philosophy of Sri-Ramanujacharya and also Vedarth-Sangraha for deepest Knowledge of the Visisthadvaita Philosophy & the Supreme Truth.

You can also refer my others answers for understanding this Philosophy here

https://hinduism.stackexchange.com/a/12497/5746

https://hinduism.stackexchange.com/a/12381/5746

https://hinduism.stackexchange.com/a/12501/5746

Adiyen Ramanuja Dasen

Srimatey Ramanujaye Namah:

Jay Sri-man Narayan

  • 1
    Do not use #heading and bold style of font too much. – Pandya Sep 12 '16 at 15:58

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