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https://www.wisdomlib.org/hinduism/book/chandogya-upanishad-english/d/doc239196.html तद्य इह रमणीयचरणा अभ्याशो ह यत्ते रमणीयां योनिमापद्येरन्ब्राह्मणयोनिं वा क्षत्रिययोनिं वा वैश्ययोनिं वाथ य इह कपूयचरणा अभ्याशो ह यत्ते कपूयां योनिमापद्येरञ्श्वयोनिं वा सूकरयोनिं वा चण्डालयोनिं वा ॥ ५.१०.७ ॥

tadya iha ramaṇīyacaraṇā abhyāśo ha yatte ramaṇīyāṃ yonimāpadyeranbrāhmaṇayoniṃ vā kṣatriyayoniṃ vā vaiśyayoniṃ vātha ya iha kapūyacaraṇā abhyāśo ha yatte kapūyāṃ yonimāpadyerañśvayoniṃ vā sūkarayoniṃ vā caṇḍālayoniṃ vā || 5.10.7 ||

  1. Among them, those who did good work in this world [in their past life] attain a good birth accordingly. They are born as a brāhmin, a kṣatriya, or a vaiśya. But those who did bad work in this world [in their past life] attain a bad birth accordingly, being born as a dog, a pig, or as a casteless person.

This translation is provided by Swami Lokeswarananda . When I looked closely , I found 2 things of interest. 1)Shudra is not mentioned . 2) Word "yonim" can mean womb too . Now in 1st line of verse :- If "yonim" in 1st line of this verse means womb then "shudra yonim" should be present because Shudra women give birth too.So "yonim" here means "birth as". Interesting thing is in Sanatan Dharma there are 2 types of birth :- Natural , and Spiritual(upanayana ceremony). Also here specifically brahmins,kshatriyas and vaishyas( twice born) are mentioned. And if "yonim" here means natural birth , then it contradicts with Skanda Purana Vol.18 Book VI , Nagar Kanda , Chapter 239 , ( Efficacy of Adoration , Penance etc.) Verse 31-34 https://www.wisdomlib.org/hinduism/book/the-skanda-purana/d/doc502218.html . So based on above conclusions is it possible that here "yonim" means 2nd birth and not the natural birth (only in 1st line of the verse , 1st line ends befor bad birth desciption)?

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  • This forum is in English; your question would best be argued with a Sanskrit pundit, not this forum. Sep 11 '21 at 6:17
  • I believe that is implicit as it requires good karma to be born in 3 other caste other Briths requires various levels of bad karma more the bad Karna ascending order us given dog>pig>chandala so to be born as chandala is lowest birth.
    – Prasanna R
    Dec 16 '21 at 16:25
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So based on above conclusions is it possible that here "yonim" means 2nd birth and not the natural birth ?

No, it can't because it mentions dogs and pigs, and one can only be born into the wombs of actual animals, not merely "as animals", whatever that means.

If "yonim" in 1st line of this verse means womb then "shudra yonim" should be present because Shudra women give birth too.

Then it should also mention every possible caste like rathakaras, nishadhas, mlecchas, etc., shouldn't it? The point of this verse is not to exhaustively list all the castes; the point is to give examples of good and bad births.

Instead of Shudra it mentions Chandala, which is the most inferior of all the castes, and is the offspring between a Brahmin woman and Shudra man.

Shudra is below Vaishya but well above Chandala.

From the Skanda Purana you quoted:

A man is no better than a Śūdra at his birth. He is called a Brāhmaṇa (Twice-born) due to the consecration.

This verse is only denigrating Brahmins who have not done upanayanam, because a Brahmin who has not done upanayanam is to be treated like a Shudra. This verse isn't permitting any caste member to do upanayanam.

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I think word yonim mentions about 2nd type of birth spiritual one even if it mentions about animals like pigs or dogs because from spiritual pov(your level of consciousness) one can be high as brahmin or low as animals.You don't have to wait next life to get punishment everything happens in this life and type of punishment you get will depend on your guna.

BG 14.7: O Arjun, rajo guṇa is of the nature of passion. It arises from worldly desires and affections, and binds the soul(jivatma) through attachment to fruitive actions.

Example if you're rajas dominated person you are attached to results because you're only working for results that are limited to your bodily needs and you will have hidden fear in you regarding the results , you are bound to suffer(dukha) this way.

BG 14.12:When the mode of passion predominates, O Arjun, the symptoms of greed, exertion for worldly gain, restlessness, and craving develop.

BG 14.18: Those situated in the mode of goodness rise upward; those in the mode of passion stay in the middle; and those in the mode of ignorance go downward

In hindi translation(gitapress) its like that those who stay in sattva guna go to heaven , those stay in rajas remain as humans or those who stay in tamsic go downwards as animals

From spiritual perspective for sattvic people its like heaven(heaven isnt the end game one have to go beyond all 3 guns BG CH14.19&20) from inside for rajas they stay as humans because they keep chasing actions/results they remain in this cycle & tamsic people go down and down(animals)

BG 14.17: From the mode of goodness arises knowledge, from the mode of passion arises greed, and from the mode of ignorance arise negligence and delusion.

Example for tamsic people : Imagine a king who doesn't even care about his subjects,only cares about food,sex and drinking he is bound and locked up in his tendencies of the body from outside he is a  human but from adhyatmik pov he is like an animal,We say humans are most intelligent species but whats the point of being a human when your intellect (buddhi) is consumed by your primitive vrittis/tendencies and he is going down and down , drinking more and more doing this he is living only as a body in an extreme way.

A tamsic dominated person wouldnt even realize this even tho he is born human he is no less than an animal thats his punishment thus going down and down.

Idk about something like heaven , hell or any kind of afterlife but this spiritual perspective can directly be experienced .

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